21st Century Breakdown

[Skylark]

Listen to the CD called Insomniac. I find it to be their second best album behind only 1,039/Smoothed Out Slappy Hours. The early stuff is punk.

Sorry, I am not going to listen to Green Day. I am not that interested. An argument for why they are punk, I would listen to that but not an album. They're just MTV pop punk.

[sans culottes]

yeah that sounds sort of contradictory... generally supporting MTV goes along with being in it for the money. Let's "make it big"

To me, "punk" simply means you don't give a fuck what other people think and think what you want. Unfortunately, people interpret this as not having a popular hairstyle. A punk could be a conservative, have clean cut looks, worship Jesus, and listen to popular music, so long as he doesn't give a fuck about what people think about that. He could also be a radical communist, an atheist, and dress up in spiked leathers. It's too ambiguous and confusing, so I'd rather leave punk as a type of music defined by the Sex Pistols, Dead Kennedys, Crass, the Ramones, etc.

[Wrench]

Sorry, I am not going to listen to Green Day. I am not that interested. An argument for why they are punk, I would listen to that but not an album. They're just MTV pop punk.

We are discussing the music side of Green Day being punk and you fail to cooperate. Your argument is completely invalid now since you fail to do what was requested. I rest my case.

[Skylark]

To me, "punk" simply means you don't give a fuck what other people think and think what you want. Unfortunately, people interpret this as not having a popular hairstyle. A punk could be a conservative, have clean cut looks, worship Jesus, and listen to popular music, so long as he doesn't give a fuck about what people think about that. He could also be a radical communist, an atheist, and dress up in spiked leathers. It's too ambiguous and confusing, so I'd rather leave punk as a type of music defined by the Sex Pistols, Dead Kennedys, Crass, the Ramones, etc.

I agree with this mostly I don't think that punk has a definite style. Punk, in a lot of ways is what it wants to be but I do not think that punk is MTV. I actually think that punk and MTV are polar opposites.

The thing is that you bring up Crass...
Even though they came after The Sex Pistols they are sort of what define punk for me. No, that doesn't mean I think every punk band needs to be DIY or crust punk (or anarcho) exclusively but I do think that each punk band sort of needs to have that sort of mentality.

Okay, Wrench, rest your case. I know what Green Day sounds like. I have heard old Green Day and I have heard new Green Day (and I don't want to listen to anymore) and I have seen them on MTV. "I rest my case"

[sans culottes]

I agree with this mostly I don't think that punk has a definite style. Punk, in a lot of ways is what it wants to be but I do not think that punk is MTV. I actually think that punk and MTV are polar opposites.

Yeah, wasn't saying MTV is punk at all and they really are opposites. But if you were to say "I'm on MTV, and I don't give a fuck!", hey, that could be a punky move. But I don't really like using the term punk anyways. All of the great punk bands never said "LOOK, WE ARE PUNK REBELS". It's counter-conformity - you want to be punk and nonconformist so you get a mohawk and wear an anarchy shirt.

The thing is that you bring up Crass...
Even though they came after The Sex Pistols they are sort of what define punk for me. No, that doesn't mean I think every punk band needs to be DIY or crust punk (or anarcho) exclusively but I do think that each punk band sort of needs to have that sort of mentality.

I'm not a Crass fan myself, but I do think a sort of DIY or independent mentality is important for a punk musician. I laugh at the idea of anarcho-pacifism, but they liked the idea and hated the man because they wanted to help the world, not because they wanted to be punk rebelz.

[Skylark]

Yeah, wasn't saying MTV is punk at all and they really are opposites. But if you were to say "I'm on MTV, and I don't give a fuck!", hey, that could be a punky move. But I don't really like using the term punk anyways. All of the great punk bands never said "LOOK, WE ARE PUNK REBELS". It's counter-conformity - you want to be punk and nonconformist so you get a mohawk and wear an anarchy shirt.I'm not a Crass fan myself, but I do think a sort of DIY or independent mentality is important for a punk musician. I laugh at the idea of anarcho-pacifism, but they liked the idea and hated the man because they wanted to help the world, not because they wanted to be punk rebelz.

I understand what you're saying... And I don't quite know why you are. I understand that they weren't trying to be punk rebels. However, I would not consider Green Day punk. I feel as if we have lost our point, here

[sans culottes]

I understand what you're saying... And I don't quite know why you are. I understand that they weren't trying to be punk rebels. However, I would not consider Green Day punk. I feel as if we have lost our point, here

EVERYTHING IS ALL CONFUSING AND STUFF.

And yeah, to me they were always pop punk. In the 90's, a good pop punk band. Today, a bad one.