Hey y'all this is a semi-serious thread from me.

I like listening to music. I like playing music. I like studying music. Sometimes I even like writing music. I've gotten to a point in my life that my mind is open to (I'd like to think) every genre, style, and tradition music has to offer. I still am sometimes dismissive of certain things off the bat, but I really try to push back against that.

The flip side of that is that I am very in touch with my own tastes. That is to say, what I enjoy about specific kinds of music, why I enjoy it, what I want to hear when I hear something, on a scale that resonates across as many genres as I can apply them to. Very often, maybe even increasingly often, I hear something, understand why I dislike it, and move on. I'm usually very quiet about the things I dislike, even though I want to have a conversation, just because I don't want to be insulting to people's tastes. And I'm sure a few of you can attest that that doesn't always happen.

I worry that what I feel is confidence in my own taste/preferences just comes across horribly. I feel like a pretentious asshole even though it's not pretense. I don't think I'm better than anyone. Maybe more experienced as a listener, but even that makes me feel like a dick to admit.

I guess my question is: how do I reconcile this kind of confidence without being perceived as an overcritical ass. Or at least how do I not care about being an overcritical ass.

I'm sure I'm blowing this out of proportion, but it takes up a lot of mental real estate here. So I'm talking about it.

Thoughts? Similar experiences? I want to hear from YOU!

I ALREADY FEEL PRETENTIOUS FOR HAVING MADE THIS THREAD

LOOK AT THIS SHIT

WHO WRITES LIKE THIS

Chill out dude. Smoke some weed. Relax

I feel like you probably have to let a lot of things you disagree with go.

It generally sounds less pretentious when you try to remain positive. Like rather than telling someone why some music is bad, you describe what you like in music you enjoy.

People connect to the positive vibes. People will get defensive when someone is critical of something that makes them happy. Especially when they might have trouble articulating why they like their music

I guess part of it is also knowing your audience and participating in the conversation at their level of interest

I also struggle a lot with trying to make sure I don't come off like an asshole. I'm always having to say I don't like things, and I'm always asking if people listen to such and such artist, only to find out they've never heard of them. So no discussion really happens.

You'd be surprised what you could find yourself enjoying though if you open up a little more and try to be more positive about what other people enjoy. I didn't think I'd find myself enjoying pop punk, but thanks to a friend, here I am.

Yeah man Sum 41 is the best

I feel like maybe I didn't really get to the meat of my issue based on your responses, though I do appreciate it.

Quote from: YPrrrr on December 15, 2020, 06:07:16 PMI feel like you probably have to let a lot of things you disagree with go.

I do. I have to.

QuoteIt generally sounds less pretentious when you try to remain positive. Like rather than telling someone why some music is bad, you describe what you like in music you enjoy.

People connect to the positive vibes. People will get defensive when someone is critical of something that makes them happy. Especially when they might have trouble articulating why they like their music

I guess part of it is also knowing your audience and participating in the conversation at their level of interest

This is all true. When I'm with new people this is generally how I try to be.

But I also find honest, thorough criticism of creative works to be hugely rewarding. When I'm with friends, including those of differing tastes (like you guys ) I like the idea of hearing why those tastes differ. I know that a lot of my favorite music is hard for a lot of people to listen to. There's some popular music among my friends that I really don't enjoy. I think a discussion about why we don't like each other's music and how it relates to the kinds of things we do like is a great way to learn about myself and others. But I can't help but feel like a huge majority of people are so put off by the idea, and by even attempting to go down this road I look like a pompous dick.

Quote from: Samus Aran on December 15, 2020, 07:09:09 PMYou'd be surprised what you could find yourself enjoying though if you open up a little more and try to be more positive about what other people enjoy. I didn't think I'd find myself enjoying pop punk, but thanks to a friend, here I am.

Again, I do try to stay open-minded. On principle I'm not gonna write off an entire genre, and in fact I would love to be converted in certain areas. Limiting one's own taste is bad. Good/bad taste doesn't exist. I'm firm in this.

Since you're aware and kind enough to not be entirely dismissive of music that other people like, maybe you just need to be less quiet about what you don't like, and kind of bridge the gap with them. "I'm not really into [band] so much, i like my [genre] a little more [style], like [band] or [other band]."

Either way yeah this is genuinely really difficult when you're really "into music." I find it very difficult to talk to most people about music, period.

And I've had to come to terms with the fact that nobody is going to listen to my recommendations.

Quote from: Samus Aran on December 15, 2020, 08:07:39 PMSince you're aware and kind enough to not be entirely dismissive of music that other people like, maybe you just need to be less quiet about what you don't like, and kind of bridge the gap with them. "I'm not really into [band] so much, i like my [genre] a little more [style], like [band] or [other band]."

I like this! Thinking about it, I tend to jump right into the why of not liking something. Seeing it like this I get why that can be off-putting.

QuoteEither way yeah this is genuinely really difficult when you're really "into music." I find it very difficult to talk to most people about music, period.

And I've had to come to terms with the fact that nobody is going to listen to my recommendations.

The answer to this, honestly, is to just get into pop. You wanna connect with more people on music? Listen to what they're listening to. That's it.

I reference the great Werner Herzog:

QuoteDo you watch any television?

I do, I watch the news from different sources. Sometimes I see things that are completely against my cultural nature. I was raised with Latin and Ancient Greek and poetry from Greek antiquity, but sometimes, just to see the world I live in, I watch "WrestleMania."

An unexpected choice.

You have to know what a good amount of the population is watching. Do not underestimate the Kardashians. As vulgar as they may be, it doesn't matter that much, but you have to find some sort of orientation. As I always say, the poet must not close his eyes, must not avert them.

So you've been watching "Keeping Up With the Kardashians?"

I'm starting to discover it. I'm curious; that's my guiding principle.

Yeah, I've been listening to more and more "popular music" the older I've gotten lol, in fact I'm not entirely sure why I had such an aversion to pop when I was younger.

Granted, I still have my tastes and my boundaries.

i am the same way about many things. i talked to my therapist about this a lot.

i have a tendency to get really into things and isolate myself from people who do them at a "casual" level. coffee, video games, bikes, music, pretty much every aspect of my life that i have put significant thought into. it takes me a while to really open up to people because of this. unless i learn that they are on a similar level about something but otherwise i stay pretty reserved about my interests. i've sort of come to terms with the fact that i feel pretentious about everything and i just need to be chill.

On the other side of this I often don't want to talk about music with Boyagers because I am not as IN-DEPTH in my fandom of music so whenever I find something I think is cool I don't really bother sharing because you guys probably know already or would think it's intro/basic shit

Which it probably is but yeah. 

i honestly haven't encountered any music elitism in a long time despite freely talking to people about music a lot. not liking music that somebody else likes doesn't inherently make you judgemental or snobby even if you express it directly. i guess it's when you start thinking of music is superior and inferior you will get that effect. if you don't feel that way then you're probably fine tbh. i don't really know how to explain it right but there is a pretty obvious way to talk about music that you dislike without being insulting or feeling insulting, i think part of it stems from how you take criticism from others about the genres of music that you love. even though you've probably fully acknowledged that everyone has different tastes, it might still feel bad to have someone explain to you all the things they don't like about your favourite music but like, why? i think if you're not defensive about your own tastes then it naturally follows that you will be able to talk more openly about music without having to potentially feel bad, or something like that. not saying with certainty that you're defensive about that stuff or anything because i honestly have no idea, but it's just my general thoughts

Quote from: YPrrrr on December 15, 2020, 10:41:42 PMOn the other side of this I often don't want to talk about music with Boyagers because I am not as IN-DEPTH in my fandom of music so whenever I find something I think is cool I don't really bother sharing because you guys probably know already or would think it's intro/basic shit

Which it probably is but yeah. 

this is like the opposite problem of being snobby about music, i think talking about music you like is a good thing regardless of how much music you've actually consumed. like bruh not everyone is gonna have listened to years of music and no matter how much you've listened to there's always gonna be way more that you haven't listened to. if you find music you think is really cool then please share it.

Quote from: Samus Aran on December 15, 2020, 08:07:39 PMAnd I've had to come to terms with the fact that nobody is going to listen to my recommendations.

i think this just boils down to the fact that everyone feels different about discovering new music, some people are just content with the music they know and enjoy already and aren't too enthusiastic about introducing new material which is fair enough tbh. that being said, i still give out a lot of recommendations because i think it's good to just put stuff out there that i like whether or not it will be listened to. while there are people who aren't keen on discovering new music, there will be people who are keen and will really appreciate the recs.

i didnt read anything.  just B urself.

Quote from: silvertone on January 25, 2021, 06:15:23 AMi didnt read anything.  just B urself.

Unironically yeah

Yeah