okay, look

[Samus Aran]

really boyah, let me just be level with you for a moment

Dante Alighieri was kind of a prick. well, not just kind of. honestly, he was a huge prick. like i mean, yeah he's got his fuckin...Terza Rima or whatever goin on and THAT'S pretty cool, i mean, THAT'S pretty neat, but...look, boyah. the guy spends half of Inferno just jerkin us around, fuckin...talking about italians. florentines. fuckin people from florence that he just HAPPENS to know. they're fuckin everywhere in goddamn Hell. why? why so many florentines? he talks to more fucking florentinianyuns than fuckin...actual people of hitorical importance and WE BOTH KNOW that even THAT is a stretch...meeting all these goddamn famous fuckin people, i mean. it's pretty cool but sometimes i really just gotta wonder if Dante was trying to stuff as much ~*culture*~ into this ~*epic poem*~ as possible so that he could hang with the cool kids.

WHICH BRINGS ME TO ANOTHER POINT

why the FUCK does a poet as seriously as FUCKIN VIRGIL hang out with this LOSER dante? FUCK. not only was Virgil just awesome as a poet, but i mean, right here in fuckin Inferno, the man SINGLE-HANDEDLY EVADES SATAN HIMSELF WHILE CARRYING DANTE ON HIS BACK. HE FUCKIN LIKE JUMPS OVER SATAN AND DOES FLIPS AND SLIDES DOWN HIS BACK AND SHIT. that's even more than the snakes who burst people into flames when they bite their souls. what was that, fuckin...6th circle? i don't even fucking remember. fuck me.

like, okay, in the poets high school, virgil is one of the cool kids. i mean personally i think he's the coolest, culturally speaking he'd obviously be inferior to homer but you know what FUCK THAT, virl was a better poet. and homer was probably actually like dozens upon dozens of scribes throughout decades, anyway, rather than just one person.

ANYWAY

dante is like the fuckin kid sitting by himself at the table just near enough to the cool kids table so that he can fawn over virgil all during lunch hour. dante had such a hard-on for virgil, wtf. not that i blame him, really. but i at least have the restraint to not write about myself frolicking around with him.

there are just so many things about dante in Inferno that make him out to be incredibly self-serving, arrogant, and probably a troll. i mean, look, half the fuckin book is him talking about florentine politics with either his personal enemies or friends. he fucking tortures his political enemies in his writing. and you know what? when he gets to the subcircle 2 of circle 9, where "betrayers of one country, political party, etc." basically go...HE MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO MENTION OF FLORENCE. ALL THAT LEAD-UP FOR NOTHING. NO ITALIANS, NO FLORENCE, NO ANYTHING. INSTEAD, JUST SOME GUY CHEWING ON THE HEAD OF SOME OTHER GUY. WTF MAN.

WHY ALL THE FLORENCE. FUCKIN ITALIAN POLITICS AND STUPID REAL-LIFE REFERENCES TO DANTE'S OWN POLITICAL GRIPES EVERYWHERE.

WHY ARE SO MANY GREEK NAMES MISLABELED? DANTE DOESN'T SEEM TO KNOW HIS MYTHOLOGY AT ALL. HELL, WHY SO MANY GREEK MONSTERS IN CHRISTIAN HELL IN THE FIRST PLACE?

and here's the real kicker. why the FUCK does fuckin DANTE get to go to fuckin HEAVEN just because some BITCH named BEATRICE fuckin WANTS HIM TO? MOSES DIDN'T EVEN GET TO GO TO HEAVEN UNTIL JESUS SAID "NAH BRO, IT'S CHILL, COME ON UP" AND UNTIL THEN HE WAS FUCKIN STUCK IN LIMBO (FIRST CIRCLE NIGGERS). BEATRICE IS JUST SOME BITCH DANTE FUCKIN STALKED IN REAL LIFE ANYWAY

DANTE ALIGHIERI: CLASSICAL LITERATURE'S BIGGEST DOUCHE  

[spoiler]i actually do like Inferno, but seriously Dante, you're a douche[/spoiler]

[applesauce]

Virgil and Florence did not exist at the same time b

[Samus Aran]

Virgil and Florence did not exist at the same time b

what does that even have to do with anything lol

also that's not even true, Florence was already established during the Roman times in which Virgil was writing and...well, existing

but seriously i am confused, why would you say that, i said nothing in this thread connecting Virgil with Florence at all lol

[PLEASEHELP1991]

Virgil and Florence did not exist at the same time b

Fluentia, Florence's direct predecessor, did xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxo

[Samus Aran]

Fluentia, Florence's direct predecessor, did xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxo

cha

obv. florence wasn't exactly florence as it'd come to be known later, but it was still basically florence

BUT THIS THREAD IS ABOUT DANTE'S DICKBAGGERY 

[applesauce]

what does that even have to do with anything lol

also that's not even true, Florence was already established during the Roman times in which Virgil was writing and...well, existing

but seriously i am confused, why would you say that, i said nothing in this thread connecting Virgil with Florence at all lol

Because it's interesting that Florence, which in some spheres is quite arguably the most important Italian city, and among the top 3-4 global cities, didn't exist in any meaningful form during Italy's first time of global importance.

Your rant just made me think of that.

[Samus Aran]

well his wife just died

maybe he's lonely

dude he didn't even love his wife, he wanted that bitch Beatrice who he only saw like twice in his life

[Andria]

Dante was cool. You just jelly you didn't write an EPIC poem

he just wanted some fresh pussy

.................

[The Hand That Fisted Everyone]

Snowy, you just played the game didn't you. you didn't even read the poem.

[Nyerp]

is this abouta n anme? i dont undrestand

[snoorkel]

just wait til you read Goethe

my uneducated view is maybe Dante wrote his epic poetry about hell with Virgil as the focal character because that is what Virgil did, in his own time (except using mythological figures instead of actual people to encode political/ethical ideas), and the early Renaissance tried hard to recreate all of the world's myths from a Christian perspective?

[spoiler=Eclogue IV (Virgil's, though I think Dante also wrote things called 'Eclogues'? he liked Virgil a lot, rightly]
Muses of Sicily, essay we now
A somewhat loftier task! Not all men love
Coppice or lowly tamarisk: sing we woods,
Woods worthy of a Consul let them be.
Now the last age by Cumae's Sibyl sung
Has come and gone, and the majestic roll
Of circling centuries begins anew:
Justice returns, returns old Saturn's reign,
With a new breed of men sent down from heaven.
Only do thou, at the boy's birth in whom
The iron shall cease, the golden race arise,
Befriend him, chaste Lucina; 'tis thine own
Apollo reigns. And in thy consulate,
This glorious age, O Pollio, shall begin,
And the months enter on their mighty march.
Under thy guidance, whatso tracks remain
Of our old wickedness, once done away,
Shall free the earth from never-ceasing fear.
He shall receive the life of gods, and see
Heroes with gods commingling, and himself
Be seen of them, and with his father's worth
Reign o'er a world at peace. For thee, O boy,
First shall the earth, untilled, pour freely forth
Her childish gifts, the gadding ivy-spray
With foxglove and Egyptian bean-flower mixed,
And laughing-eyed acanthus. Of themselves,
Untended, will the she-goats then bring home
Their udders swollen with milk, while flocks afield
Shall of the monstrous lion have no fear.
Thy very cradle shall pour forth for thee
Caressing flowers. The serpent too shall die,
Die shall the treacherous poison-plant, and far
And wide Assyrian spices spring. But soon
As thou hast skill to read of heroes' fame,
And of thy father's deeds, and inly learn
What virtue is, the plain by slow degrees
With waving corn-crops shall to golden grow,
From the wild briar shall hang the blushing grape,
And stubborn oaks sweat honey-dew. Nathless
Yet shall there lurk within of ancient wrong
Some traces, bidding tempt the deep with ships,
Gird towns with walls, with furrows cleave the earth.
Therewith a second Tiphys shall there be,
Her hero-freight a second Argo bear;
New wars too shall arise, and once again
Some great Achilles to some Troy be sent.
Then, when the mellowing years have made thee man,
No more shall mariner sail, nor pine-tree bark
Ply traffic on the sea, but every land
Shall all things bear alike: the glebe no more
Shall feel the harrow's grip, nor vine the hook;
The sturdy ploughman shall loose yoke from steer,
Nor wool with varying colours learn to lie;
But in the meadows shall the ram himself,
Now with soft flush of purple, now with tint
Of yellow saffron, teach his fleece to shine.
While clothed in natural scarlet graze the lambs.
"Such still, such ages weave ye, as ye run,"
Sang to their spindles the consenting Fates
By Destiny's unalterable decree.
Assume thy greatness, for the time draws nigh,
Dear child of gods, great progeny of Jove!
See how it totters- the world's orbed might,
Earth, and wide ocean, and the vault profound,
All, see, enraptured of the coming time!
Ah! might such length of days to me be given,
And breath suffice me to rehearse thy deeds,
Nor Thracian Orpheus should out-sing me then,
Nor Linus, though his mother this, and that
His sire should aid- Orpheus Calliope,
And Linus fair Apollo. Nay, though Pan,
With Arcady for judge, my claim contest,
With Arcady for judge great Pan himself
Should own him foiled, and from the field retire.
Begin to greet thy mother with a smile,
O baby-boy! ten months of weariness
For thee she bore: O baby-boy, begin!
For him, on whom his parents have not smiled,
Gods deem not worthy of their board or bed.[/spoiler]

[Samus Aran]

my uneducated view is maybe Dante wrote his epic poetry about hell with Virgil as the focal character because that is what Virgil did, in his own time (except using mythological figures instead of actual people to encode political/ethical ideas), and the early Renaissance tried hard to recreate all of the world's myths from a Christian perspective?

yes, admittedly, virgil did some similar things as well, and of course virgil in turn had a massive hard-on for homer. virgil even included augustus by name in the aeneid - he wrote himself into favor with augustus.

but you know what? he did it way better and he doesn't spend half of the aeneid saying things with overt political messages in them.

the aeneid even has comedy that is so elegantly and effortlessly weaved into the serious drama of aeneas. virgil was so fuckin good, seriously. so like i said i don't blame dante for trying to be the next virgil. but he was way out of his league, imo.

[snoorkel]

yes, admittedly, virgil did some similar things as well, and of course virgil in turn had a massive hard-on for homer. virgil even included augustus by name in the aeneid - he wrote himself into favor with augustus.

but you know what? he did it way better and he doesn't spend half of the aeneid saying things with overt political messages in them.

the aeneid even has comedy that is so elegantly and effortlessly weaved into the serious drama of aeneas. virgil was so fuckin good, seriously. so like i said i don't blame dante for trying to be the next virgil. but he was way out of his league, imo.

agreed completely, dante was just another medieval screw-off. virgil was one of the last of the great epics, I get the feeling he actually understood it all for exactly what it was.